Bulls' Mirotic: 'I'm not feeling the same confidence I was before

[ChiSoxCity]

So he handles the ball less and has "almost as good" assist to turnover ratio as rose? Not sure what you're trying to insinuate here.

Listen, if guys feel differently about him that's fine. Simply disagreeing doesn't make one a troll. Niko is extremely streaky and inconsistent. Until he finds some level of consistency, i can't get too excited about what skills he's shown sporadically. It's about consistent results.

You watch the game last night?

 

[czman]

Fans who think making shots=good play don't get it. Mirtoic did not play all that well. He shot 60% from 3. That is what he did. He was 1/3 in the mid-range game and had a drive. His 5 foul shots (3 from a stupid defensive player on a 3 pointer and 2 were on a lose ball foul over the limit where a PG tried to block him out.) were not things you can count on regularly.

His limitations were still present in that game. He just made some 3s in stead of missing them and an disciplined defense made a few really bad fouls. He is still weak under the paint and can't move his feet on the perimeter. His help defense is no existent. He still takes bad shots and does not play well in tight spaces.

If he shoots 60% from 3 he will be a special player. Since we can all assume that is not going to happen I am not sure why people are making this game out to be anything special.

Making shots does not mean you player well and missing shots does not mean you were horrible. These guys are all professionals there are going to be days where the ball is going through the hoop and where they can't hit water from a boat.

12 of his points came from shots/attempts at the 3 point line. He is shooting 35% from 3 and 33% for his career, although only two season. I want to see a season where he shots ~40 from 3.

 

[Enasic]

Fans who think making shots=good play don't get it. Mirtoic did not play all that well. He shot 60% from 3. That is what he did. He was 1/3 in the mid-range game and had a drive. His 5 foul shots (3 from a stupid defensive player on a 3 pointer and 2 were on a lose ball foul over the limit where a PG tried to block him out.) were not things you can count on regularly.

His limitations were still present in that game. He just made some 3s in stead of missing them and an disciplined defense made a few really bad fouls. He is still weak under the paint and can't move his feet on the perimeter. His help defense is no existent. He still takes bad shots and does not play well in tight spaces.

If he shoots 60% from 3 he will be a special player. Since we can all assume that is not going to happen I am not sure why people are making this game out to be anything special.

Making shots does not mean you player well and missing shots does not mean you were horrible. These guys are all professionals there are going to be days where the ball is going through the hoop and where they can't hit water from a boat.

12 of his points came from shots/attempts at the 3 point line. He is shooting 35% from 3 and 33% for his career, although only two season. I want to see a season where he shots ~40 from 3.

You summed up perfectly my evaluation of him. We see the exact same things. He's a spot up shooter with functional ability to put the ball down. Hardly a strength of his. Great breakdown.

 

[The Hawk]

Fans who think making shots=good play don't get it. Mirtoic did not play all that well. He shot 60% from 3. That is what he did. He was 1/3 in the mid-range game and had a drive. His 5 foul shots (3 from a stupid defensive player on a 3 pointer and 2 were on a lose ball foul over the limit where a PG tried to block him out.) were not things you can count on regularly.

His limitations were still present in that game. He just made some 3s in stead of missing them and an disciplined defense made a few really bad fouls. He is still weak under the paint and can't move his feet on the perimeter. His help defense is no existent. He still takes bad shots and does not play well in tight spaces.

If he shoots 60% from 3 he will be a special player. Since we can all assume that is not going to happen I am not sure why people are making this game out to be anything special.

Making shots does not mean you player well and missing shots does not mean you were horrible. These guys are all professionals there are going to be days where the ball is going through the hoop and where they can't hit water from a boat.

12 of his points came from shots/attempts at the 3 point line. He is shooting 35% from 3 and 33% for his career, although only two season. I want to see a season where he shots ~40 from 3.

I think that talent wise he is the real deal. I just hate the offensive game plan that Hoiberg employs. He is one of the guys on the team who can push the ball up court and run. They should do that more. And rather than him having to hang out well beyond the 3 point line, they should post him at the free throw line where he can use his court vision to dish, fake and shoot or take it to the hole.

My starting unit would be Rose, Butler, Niko, Gibson, and Portis with Butler at the top of the key not Niko. Feed it to the high post(Mirotic) , and let Gibson post up low with Portis acting as the SF. WHen Gasol comes in do the same thing with Gasol at the free throw line. Regardless of what they do though, they have no real skilled smaller talent beyond Rose, Butler, and sometimes Brooks who is a liability defensively.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

Fans who think making shots=good play don't get it. Mirtoic did not play all that well. He shot 60% from 3. That is what he did. He was 1/3 in the mid-range game and had a drive. His 5 foul shots (3 from a stupid defensive player on a 3 pointer and 2 were on a lose ball foul over the limit where a PG tried to block him out.) were not things you can count on regularly.

His limitations were still present in that game. He just made some 3s in stead of missing them and an disciplined defense made a few really bad fouls. He is still weak under the paint and can't move his feet on the perimeter. His help defense is no existent. He still takes bad shots and does not play well in tight spaces.

If he shoots 60% from 3 he will be a special player. Since we can all assume that is not going to happen I am not sure why people are making this game out to be anything special.

Making shots does not mean you player well and missing shots does not mean you were horrible. These guys are all professionals there are going to be days where the ball is going through the hoop and where they can't hit water from a boat.

12 of his points came from shots/attempts at the 3 point line. He is shooting 35% from 3 and 33% for his career, although only two season. I want to see a season where he shots ~40 from 3.

Defense? Really? No one truly plays defense in the NBA anymore. The rules have made it so.

There are many elite players in the NBA who play mediocre 1-on-1 defense. Big men with his offensive ability are rare in the NBA.

Let me ask you guys who don't like Mirotic a question. For those of you old enough to see Toni Kukoc play, did you feel the same way about him? In my estimation, Mirotic as good or better than Kukoc was.

 

[schizm032003]

This, it's a contentious player environment with a lot of stupid big headed leaders who think they know how it should be, compounded by what looks like a weak coach in over his head schematically.

We are in fighting, and not holding star players accountable or defining roles for young players like Mirotic. With everyone walking on egg shells your streaky players feel unloved and confused and his funk is severe. When I look at his length, and shooting ability, and movement skills I can't believe he is playing this bad. He is playing stupid and there is clearly not the proper support structure around him to get him right and doing the right things on the court to pull him out.

I can't believe what I am seeing with the group of talent and the most glaring wtf is the use and loss of Mirotic.

I'm not ready to axe Hoiberg because of the 100 point streak, but I'm biting my cheeks very hard and wish I was inside to know what the fuck is wrong with the accountability on this team.

Mark Jackson with Billups as a protege assistant. Still my choice to bolster Rose.

I don't think Hoiberg was a good hire at all. It seems to me that he has no control over his players, or respect from these guys. Everyones walking around wanting to be the man, I don't feel like there is anyone happy on the team, no chemistry, nothing. It's just a bunch of talented guys worried more about their own numbers than how the team plays together as a whole. The whole getting rid of Thibs for an offensive minded coach is looking like it's gonna blow up in our faces. Paxson and Forman has got to go. They can't really seem to put together a championship team, they make bone headed decisions, and I think with the talent we have, and have had in the recent past, we should have been a championship contender. There is a lot of talent on the team, but right now it seems that the lack of chemistry is gonna implode this team before it ever actually comes together. We need to fire Paxson, Forman, and Hoiberg. That man should never have been hired in the first place.

 

[The Hawk]

Defense? Really? No one truly plays defense in the NBA anymore. The rules have made it so.

There are many elite players in the NBA who play mediocre 1-on-1 defense. Big men with his offensive ability are rare in the NBA.

Let me ask you guys who don't like Mirotic a question. For those of you old enough to see Toni Kukoc play, did you feel the same way about him? In my estimation, Mirotic as good or better than Kukoc was.

I don't know about that. I think that on another team, Kukoc would have made some all-star teams but he had to defer to Jordan and Pippen who hated him.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

I don't think Hoiberg was a good hire at all. It seems to me that he has no control over his players, or respect from these guys. Everyones walking around wanting to be the man, I don't feel like there is anyone happy on the team, no chemistry, nothing. It's just a bunch of talented guys worried more about their own numbers than how the team plays together as a whole. The whole getting rid of Thibs for an offensive minded coach is looking like it's gonna blow up in our faces. Paxson and Forman has got to go. They can't really seem to put together a championship team, they make bone headed decisions, and I think with the talent we have, and have had in the recent past, we should have been a championship contender. There is a lot of talent on the team, but right now it seems that the lack of chemistry is gonna implode this team before it ever actually comes together. We need to fire Paxson, Forman, and Hoiberg. That man should never have been hired in the first place.

The malcontents will be gone soon enough. I think Hoiberg is a good coach and he'll work out just fine.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

I don't know about that. I think that on another team, Kukoc would have made some all-star teams but he had to defer to Jordan and Pippen who hated him.

Yes, but my point is Mirotic has a similar game to Kukoc. He's only 24 years old on a veteran dominated team with less than 2 years in the league. We need to give him some time to develop his game.

 

[PolarBear]

Yes, but my point is Mirotic has a similar game to Kukoc. He's only 24 years old on a veteran dominated team with less than 2 years in the league. We need to give him some time to develop his game.

First he is Dirk and now he is Kukoc. Your analysis is getting worse.

Also, what exactly do you think he is going to develop that he hasn't already? He gets by already on being a skillful and savvy player. He doesn't really have a lot of potential because he is limited athletically. Unless he develops a post game like Dirk, he is just another soft, Euro stretch 4.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

First he is Dirk and now he is Kukoc. Your analysis is getting worse.

Also, what exactly do you think he is going to develop that he hasn't already? He gets by already on being a skillful and savvy player. He doesn't really have a lot of potential because he is limited athletically. Unless he develops a post game like Dirk, he is just another soft, Euro stretch 4.

When you say he is limited athletically, who would you compare him too? I'm just trying to understand your thought process, because I see a kid who's damn near 7-foot tall dribbling, passing and shooting like a 3 or 4. To me, that is athletic.

 

[Crystallas]

He's actually not all that limited athletically. Has a decent vertical and he can run. Maybe not elite levels, but for his size, only a few have better comps.

 

[czman]

Defense? Really? No one truly plays defense in the NBA anymore. The rules have made it so.

There are many elite players in the NBA who play mediocre 1-on-1 defense. Big men with his offensive ability are rare in the NBA.

Let me ask you guys who don't like Mirotic a question. For those of you old enough to see Toni Kukoc play, did you feel the same way about him? In my estimation, Mirotic as good or better than Kukoc was.

Plenty of players in the league play better defense than him. He is bad, even by these standards.

Kukoc, was not a star, you know that. Kukoc was a good player who had a unique skill set that not many players had at that time. Mirotic is not unique, 20 years ago he would have been. In this day and age 6'10" tweeners who have can't defend the 3/4 and are averages shooters with limited off the bounce game are actually pretty common. Additionally, Kukoc was a much better passer and dribbler. Mirotic and Kukoc have very little in common from a basketball skill set. Mirotic is a gunner. Toni was a pass first player with better post moves and a much better help defender.

I would say this is a terrible comp. They are really nothing a like. I guess they are both white and not born in America.

 

[czman]

When you say he is limited athletically, who would you compare him too? I'm just trying to understand your thought process, because I say a kid who's damn near 7-foot tall dribbling, passing and shooting like a 3 or 4. To me, that is athletic.

His it limited athletically because basket ball is not a straight line speed contest. Mirotic has limited lateral quickness and ability to change direction. He also is weak for a 4. Your definition of athletic, "near 7-foot tall dribbling, passing and shooting like a 3 or 4" is special.

 

[PolarBear]

When you say he is limited athletically, who would you compare him too? I'm just trying to understand your thought process, because I say a kid who's damn near 7-foot tall dribbling, passing and shooting like a 3 or 4. To me, that is athletic.

Dribbling is a skill.

Passing is a skill.

Shooting is a skill.

A simple health and physical education class will tell you that.

He is a skillful player no doubt about it. He is a good passer for a big, has a nice handle and an inconsistent jumper. That does not make him athletic. He runs the floor well but his lateral quickness and first step is lacking.

 

[ChiSoxCity]

Dribbling is a skill.

Passing is a skill.

Shooting is a skill.

A simple health and physical education class will tell you that.

He is a skillful player no doubt about it. He is a good passer for a big, has a nice handle and an inconsistent jumper. That does not make him athletic. He runs the floor well but his lateral quickness and first step is lacking.

Again, what is athletic to you? Can you define it in relative terms atleast?

 

[houheffna]

I don't know about that. I think that on another team, Kukoc would have made some all-star teams but he had to defer to Jordan and Pippen who hated him.

Where did you get that from? Jordan and Pippen liked Kukoc. They liked Kukoc more than they liked Rodman. He wasn't held back by them at all. He played better with Jordan than he would have with anyone else.

 

[PolarBear]

Again, what is athletic to you? Can you define it in relative terms atleast?

A combination of fitness factors make up athleticism -

- Speed
- Agility
- Strength
- Power
- Coordination
- Balance
- Quickness
- Flexibility
- Endurance
- Aerobic/Anaerobic Capacity

Some of these factors are more relevant to basketball than others. Mirotic lacks agility, power, quickness and strength.

 

[houheffna]

Again, what is athletic to you? Can you define it in relative terms atleast?

Sorry man, Mirotic isn't athletic, not by NBA standards he isn't.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Mirotic has clearly demonstrated his offensive skills. I see no point in arguing about this.

When he plays well, the Bulls win. Period.

Getting him into the starting lineup and getting him the ball is the best thing for the Bulls right now.

Interesting that his numbers are somewhat better in losses than wins.

"Period."