Peter Gammons: "it's a dump, Wrigley Field."

daddies3angels

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It's not a matter of opinion. Soto had a .890 OPS. Poseys was like .862. Soto was clearly better. Than all of them. Even Mauer.

Soto just cant stay consistent...seems have good year, bad year, good year and so far bad year
 

DewsSox79

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It's not a matter of opinion. Soto had a .890 OPS. Poseys was like .862. Soto was clearly better. Than all of them. Even Mauer.

Homer.jpg
 

DewsSox79

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anyone puts soto in the same sentence with mauer is fucking Special person. Atleast I get to laugh at some of this shit I read on here.
 

Rick

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It's not a matter of opinion. Soto had a .890 OPS. Poseys was like .862. Soto was clearly better. Than all of them. Even Mauer.



Oh man, this is too much.


I don't care what the stats are, I'd rather have Posey or Mauer over Soto any day. There's much more potential in those guys than in Soto.


Soto can't even produce two good straight years in a row
 

DewsSox79

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Oh man, this is too much.


I don't care what the stats are, I'd rather have Posey or Mauer over Soto any day. There's much more potential in those guys than in Soto.


Soto can't even produce two good straight years in a row

Especially Mauer.
 

FirstTimer

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It's not a matter of opinion. Soto had a .890 OPS. Poseys was like .862. Soto was clearly better. Than all of them. Even Mauer.

Because clearly OPS is the ONLY stat that matters.

Buster: Hit for a higher average, hit more HR's, drove in more runs, and actually slugged for a higher percentage. Congrats. Soto had a higher OBP. Woopty fucking doo.

Yeah, I'm taking Posey last year 10 out of 10 times.

Mauer last season: Higher average, more RBI's, higher OBP. Soto lead in HR's, slugging, and OPS. But Mauer had the higher OPS+. Even in an "off year" so to speak for Mauer I'd take him.

Victor Martinez: Higher average, more HR's, more RBI's. Geo lead in OPB and SLG.

I'm taking V-Mart here too more often than not.



Catchers I'd easily rather have than Soto on a year in year out basis regardless of what Soto did for one season.(in no real order):

McCann
Victor Martinez
Posey
Mauer


LOL at you thinking Soto ran away with anything last year in terms of being the best offensive catcher.

You could argue he wasn't even the best offensive catcher in the NL, let alone the MLB.....and that's really only because McCann had a bit of an off year. If McCann even has a career average season last year McCann>Soto.
 

poodski

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dont put fucking words in my mouth. Im a baseball fan. If the cubs win the world series I have no emotion, if they lose the world series I have no emotion. the only time it would be different is if the wsox were playing them. So dont fucking put words in my fucking mouth.

LOL then why do you come in here constantly and say negative things about the Cubs.

You hate the Cubs just admit it.

For someone that says I am just a Sox hater I could find ten times as many posts from you saying negative things about the Cubs than you could find me saying about the Sox.

Hell outside of the RF debate and the Prior debate bring me all the posts you can find about me saying negative things about the Sox. I will triple them with your posts.
 

poodski

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He didnt spend 135 million on this team. Last owner did and he just bought into it. Honestly do you see Ricketts keeping up this kind of payroll having to pay back Bank loans, and keep up with Wrigley field? I dont so Cub fans will have to deal with shitty teams until he pays off bank loans etc. So again Cub fans will have to suffer through it. We all know if Cuban bought team he would have spent the money to win WS

Yes because if he wouldn't have the payroll would have sat at 125 million and Colvin/LaHair or even like a Russell Branyan would have been brought in.

We certainly wouldn't have just released Silva either and eaten all that money. He would have started and tried to at least salvage some money.

Was 90% of the salary from before Ricketts? Yes, but the other 10% came this year and honestly wasn't needed.

There is ZERO indication that this team will all of a sudden have a 100 million dollar payroll, and until someone shows something saying that they are just literally talking out of their ass.
 

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Yes because if he wouldn't have the payroll would have sat at 125 million and Colvin/LaHair or even like a Russell Branyan would have been brought in.

We certainly wouldn't have just released Silva either and eaten all that money. He would have started and tried to at least salvage some money.

Was 90% of the salary from before Ricketts? Yes, but the other 10% came this year and honestly wasn't needed.

There is ZERO indication that this team will all of a sudden have a 100 million dollar payroll, and until someone shows something saying that they are just literally talking out of their ass.

You have yet to answer why you are so amazingly confident that we will land Fielder.

?

Why do you think we will?
 

poodski

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Because clearly OPS is the ONLY stat that matters.

Buster: Hit for a higher average, hit more HR's, drove in more runs, and actually slugged for a higher percentage. Congrats. Soto had a higher OBP. Woopty fucking doo.

Yeah, I'm taking Posey last year 10 out of 10 times.

Mauer last season: Higher average, more RBI's, higher OBP. Soto lead in HR's, slugging, and OPS. But Mauer had the higher OPS+. Even in an "off year" so to speak for Mauer I'd take him.

Victor Martinez: Higher average, more HR's, more RBI's. Geo lead in OPB and SLG.

I'm taking V-Mart here too more often than not.



Catchers I'd easily rather have than Soto on a year in year out basis regardless of what Soto did for one season.(in no real order):

McCann
Victor Martinez
Posey
Mauer


LOL at you thinking Soto ran away with anything last year in terms of being the best offensive catcher.

You could argue he wasn't even the best offensive catcher in the NL, let alone the MLB.....and that's really only because McCann had a bit of an off year. If McCann even has a career average season last year McCann>Soto.

Basically you are arguing apples and oranges in the second half of this argument. Unless CO said somewhere that he would take Soto over every other catcher then what he is saying is 100% correct.

Offensively Soto was the best catcher in baseball last year and there is absolutely no debating that. He had the better wOBA, wRC+, and the highest OPS. Overall production per PA he was the best.

If you want to use BA and counting stats, then well you are wasting your time.

I would take upwards of 10 catchers over Soto present and going forward, but that doesn't negate he was the best offensive catcher in the majors last year.

The only player that could even be argued would be Mauer and thats only because he had 200 more PA than Soto. Even using a counting stat like wRAA only Mauer was better.

Pound for pound Soto was the best, and he was definitely better than Posey, V-Mart, and McCann even if you use counting stats.
 

poodski

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You have yet to answer why you are so amazingly confident that we will land Fielder.

?

Why do you think we will?

Because there is no indication we wont. He was willing to spend in 2011, so why in 2012 will he be like "well fuck we better only spend 100 million"

It makes no sense. Plus said last year he isn't cutting payroll.

Like I said earlier attendance is only down 10% so even if payroll is cut 10% that leaves us with a 126.5 million dollar payroll.
 

poodski

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Oh man, this is too much.


I don't care what the stats are, I'd rather have Posey or Mauer over Soto any day. There's much more potential in those guys than in Soto.


Soto can't even produce two good straight years in a row

You aren't even arguing the same thing.

Is Soto better than Mauer and Posey offensively? No.

Was Soto better than them in 2010? Yes.

Huge difference between talent and production in a specific time frame. People need to realize that.
 

FirstTimer

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Because there is no indication we wont.
Simply because (you feel) the cubs will spend money this offseason doesn't mean we land Fielder. I'm asking you why are confident we will get Fielder. Not that we will spend money in general.

Why will Fielder sign here? What makes you so confident that he will?

"There is no indication that we won't", then going on to discuss how much you think the Cubs will spend isn't an answer.

The Cubs could very well spend $120 million next season on payroll but spending that much and landing Fielder aren't mutually exclusive.


You aren't even arguing the same thing.

Is Soto better than Mauer and Posey offensively? No.

Was Soto better than them in 2010? Yes.
Not better than Posey.
Sorry.



Basically you are arguing apples and oranges in the second half of this argument. Unless CO said somewhere that he would take Soto over every other catcher then what he is saying is 100% correct.
I was stating that just for the record.

I thought that was clear...then again..........


Offensively Soto was the best catcher in baseball last year
He wasn't.

Blind resume I'm taking Posey. And it's not close.


and he was definitely better than Posey, V-Mart, even if you use counting stats.

I showed that he was "obviously" not.

Posey had him in every counting stat except OBP. Strike up the band!

Posey>Soto last year offensively. Save your BS sabremetric babble for someone else.
 

Rice Cube

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Soto couldn't drive in runs because he was stupidly being batted eighth in the lineup and thus had nobody to drive in. He also walked more than he probably did otherwise because he was "protected" by the pitcher. However he did show good plate discipline and had decent power. He's just really inconsistent and that's why if you look at them career-wise, Soto is not better than the others listed.
 

FirstTimer

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Soto couldn't drive in runs because he was stupidly being batted eighth in the lineup and thus had nobody to drive in. He also walked more than he probably did otherwise because he was "protected" by the pitcher. However he did show good plate discipline and had decent power. He's just really inconsistent and that's why if you look at them career-wise, Soto is not better than the others listed.

Whatever Rice. Soto's VOPR VAP VIPPY CADOODLE was +32456.

Posey's was a mere +31578
 

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